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Grizzly 700 vs Can-Am Outlander 650 - my impression...

This is a discussion on Grizzly 700 vs Can-Am Outlander 650 - my impression... within the Grizzly Talk forums, part of the Grizzly Forums category; Stopped by the local Can-Am dealer first to check out the Can-Ams. First was this one: 2012 (Gen 1) Outlander 650 XT Love the colour. ...


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#1
11-03-2012, 05:00 PM
Grizzly 700 vs Can-Am Outlander 650 - my impression...

Stopped by the local Can-Am dealer first to check out the Can-Ams.

First was this one: 2012 (Gen 1) Outlander 650 XT







Love the colour. Pretty fast once you get the RPM's up. That's it. Everything else I hated. Stupid "left only" brake lever. Hideous gauges. Felt like a truck to drive. Heavy. No nimbleness at all. Sounded cool at first, but annoying after 5 mins. Some really stupid design features - the battery is completely outside, down low, and unprotected. Wouldn't buy one for half the price they retail at. In fact - I would rather drive my wife's Honda 420.

Next was the new Gen 2 2013 Outlander 650 XT.







Not mad about the yellow - a bit too "Tonka Toy" for my tastes. Would look bad-ass in the silver like the 2012. Great looking bike. I just love the looks. Much better suspension / chassis than the Gen 1 2012 - less like a dump truck. But STILL just felt heavy and solid. In fact, it felt like driving a solid-axle truck with handlebars. Again - once into the mid RPM and up it takes off like a scalded cat...but unless all you ride is fire roads - it was a pig. I hated it too. And I REALLY REALLY wanted to like it, I did. Not the bike for me, not at all. Might be OK if you lived in the desert. I can't imagine what a dog it would be in the rocks.

So, then it was off to the Yamaha dealer to re-try the 700 Grizzly - just to make sure I wasn't having false memories of it and therefore unfairly being to harsh on the Can-Ams.

Nope - I wasn't. The Grizz feels like a dirt bike with 4 wheels. Very light and nimble. Great ergonomics. Great gauges. And WAY superior controls - brakes at both hands (front on the right where it should be) - and a full, selectable locker. And the torque of the big 700 single is awesome. Off the line it is much snappier than the Can-Ams even though it only has 47HP to the 650 twins 62. I'd love to see the torque curves from idle up for both bikes - coz peak hp figures sure don't tell the story.

The Grizz handles like it's 200 lbs lighter, and I bet it's at least 100 lbs lighter in reality.

And the coup de grace - they had the new tactical black there. Here's some pics:







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11-03-2012, 06:02 PM
nice write up and that is a sharp looking grizz!
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#3
11-03-2012, 08:06 PM
Spoken like a true hater. My can am 1000XT handles awesome in the rocks. My grizzly did to. In fact stock for stock the suspension on my can am is way more plush and i can ride harder and faster than when im on the grizzly. I had to put elkas know the grizzly just to ride the rocky trails here in ak. The grizzly is a great machine and the can am is def no dog or pig. The extra weight is more than worth it when i got 1000cc of power under me. I can take corners faster than know the grizzly. I am able to break the back end loose with the blip of the throttle.
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#4
11-03-2012, 09:03 PM
If your looking for a better ride in a different brand that is smooth then the Rincon 680 with not as many features as the Grizzly does ride nice, but I think the Grizzly rides better and outperforms the Honda and the Outlander.
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#5
11-04-2012, 07:43 AM
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Spoken like a true hater. My can am 1000XT handles awesome in the rocks. My grizzly did to. In fact stock for stock the suspension on my can am is way more plush and i can ride harder and faster than when im on the grizzly. I had to put elkas know the grizzly just to ride the rocky trails here in ak. The grizzly is a great machine and the can am is def no dog or pig. The extra weight is more than worth it when i got 1000cc of power under me. I can take corners faster than know the grizzly. I am able to break the back end loose with the blip of the throttle.

Nah - a hater is someone who communicates a strong dislike for something, based solely on some irrational belief and not on subjective or objective merit. The formation of a hater's contempt commonly arises from jealously and/or resentment.

Me, I had no preconceived opinions, and not owning or having previously owned either bike I have no belief system or prior decision making to defend.

In fact, if anything, as I said, I really wanted to like the Can-Am because I love the looks of it and the power numbers are awesome.

But I just didn't. Based solely on my first hand, back-to-back riding impressions. There's no need to feel threatened by that, I'm not saying anyone who feels different or who makes a different decision (i.e. prefers or buys a Can-Am over a Grizz) is an idiot - far from it. They are VERY different machines. I simply stated my impressions and opinions of the bikes.
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11-04-2012, 08:20 AM
Billavista,
I've owned two Grizzly 700s. I owned a Can Am Outlander 1000 last year, and I still own a Can Am Renegade 1000 now.

Where did you test ride these ATVs? Was it around the dealers paved lot, or did you get to do some dirt trails? How long were the test rides?

You're right that the Can Am feels enormous compared to the sportier more nimble feeling Yamaha. I don't know what the G2 650 weighs, but I think it would be fairly close to a G2 1000. The 1000 weighs 902 lbs with one gallon of gas in the tank. Doesn't the Grizzly weigh 660 lbs with a gallon of gas in the tank? That is a 240 lb difference vs the 1000, so probably a 200 lb difference vs the 650. I think you are feeling the extra 200 lbs and the overall enormous size of the Can Am. Just wondering if you're feeling that difference in a parking lot, or actually out on the trail. If your opinion is based on a parking lot test ride, it may change out on the trail where the more powerful Can Am would be more in its element. The Grizzly would still feel more nimble, but the Can Am at least wouldn't feel so awkward
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#7
11-04-2012, 11:50 AM
Hi 3TV,

You're certainly better qualified than I to compare the two, no doubt about it. Perhaps I was a little harsh in my criticism of the Can-Am - I was just stunned at the difference and a little disappointed personally. They are very different machines for sure.

Both rides were "off road" -dirt tracks, wet grass, ditches, a few bumps and corners - but nothing major and not really indicative of true off-road trails with lots of rocks and roots and such. Both were pretty short too - maybe only 15-20 mins. But I felt it was enough to really show the difference in the feel of the different bikes.

Interestingly, I note that Can-Am no longer list weights in the specs on its website, and I think it was pretty well established that they tended to be under-rated when they did. But anyway - I get the distinct impression it's more than just the difference in the scale weights, although that does play a big role obviously. I can liken it to the difference between my KTM 200 XC-W compared to my buddy's Honda CR-450. On the scale his doesn't weigh a whole bunch more than mine - but man does it ever feel a lot heavier to ride. It's the torque of the engine, the rotating mass, the suspension - it all contributes to a much less nimble, flickable bike. Of course, his is way more powerful too. Two very different bikes for two very different purposes - his kicks ass on the track and wipes me on the fire roads - mine is pure joy in the tight woods and rocky single track.

And so it is, in my humble limited opinion, with the 650 XT vs the 700 Grizzly. I was amazed at the difference, that's all. And I personally value nimbleness a lot - I like to be able to steer with foot pressure and body english and ride it like a 4-wheel dirt bike, which the Grizz feels like, as opposed to a fast and solid small truck which the Outlander felt like to me.

But most of all, I intend no value judgement of anyone and their choices - I was trying to just talk about the way the machines felt and not infer any characteristics of anyone who chooses one or the other.

Bottom line - for anyone reading this who is shopping and researching and wondering, I recommend you ride both and choose which you like because they feel very, very different (to me).
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11-04-2012, 12:31 PM
I think you're correct, there is more to it than just the weight difference. Your analogy with dirt bikes is right on as well. That KTM of yours uses a 125 frame, and weighs just 209 lbs. It feels like a flea flicker compared to the 450 Honda. I notice the same night and day difference in flickability when I go from riding my KTM 505 XC-F to riding my sons KTM 300 XC.

Your test drives sound like pretty decent test. Around here you're doing good to be able to start the ATV in the parking lot before you buy it. None of our dealers would even consider letting someone ride one on a dirt track.

If you're still in the test drive mood, go test drive a Sportsman 850 XP limited edition (with power steering). I would be interested in hearing your thoughts on that ATV. It is a heavyweight, almost as much so as the Can Am, but the handling and suspension are worlds better. I'm an ex-desert racer, and have learned that handling and suspension win races, not power. I don't race anymore, but at the end of the day that improved handling and suspension are still the most important to me. I've ridden all of the big utility ATVs, and I thought the Sportsman XP has the best handling of them all.
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11-04-2012, 01:06 PM
To each his own man. Thats why they make a bunch of different ATVs. Some one might hate brand x but love brand y and someone else might hate brand y but love brand x. Glad you found the one thats right for you!!

I cant imagine how you feel the way you do about the can am's, but hey... everyone has different opinions.
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#10
11-04-2012, 01:17 PM
i don't think an expression of opinions of two different machines when he owns either of them makes a "true hater".

starting the post "can am sucks" would be more fitting of a "true hater".
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#11
11-04-2012, 01:42 PM
I just think its funny that all the grizzly owners always have negative things to say about all the other brands. You know little man syndrome. The grizzly has a reputation of being tipsy so how is that the best handling? And comparing a atv to riding a dirt bike is retarded. There is no comparison at all. Totally two different worlds. I have a kx450f and riding that is no way similar to riding a wheeler. Maybe that's your problem.....trying to start off comparing two different worlds.
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11-04-2012, 02:46 PM
Nah, I can see him comparing an ATV to a dirt bike, because I've done the same thing. I thought that the DS 650 was the ATV equivalent of the CR 500 dirt bikes I raced years ago. They were a little crude and unrefined, but were big and fast, brutally strong, and unbreakable. They had long travel suspension and sucked up the chop and hack of untracked desert better than the small 450cc sport ATVs did.
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11-04-2012, 03:59 PM
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Your test drives sound like pretty decent test. Around here you're doing good to be able to start the ATV in the parking lot before you buy it. None of our dealers would even consider letting someone ride one on a dirt track.
First, thanks for engaging in a literate, adult conversation with me :)

And yes, I was pleasantly surprised too. I've never previously been able to just walk up to a dealer and test drive a sport bike or even dirt bike before (I guess for fairly obvious reasons) so I wasn't sure what would happen with the ATVs. Pretty lucky for sure.

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If you're still in the test drive mood, go test drive a Sportsman 850 XP limited edition (with power steering). I would be interested in hearing your thoughts on that ATV. It is a heavyweight, almost as much so as the Can Am, but the handling and suspension are worlds better.
I might just do that - especially if I can find a dealer who will also let me ride it off-road a bit (maybe 3 for 3 would be too lucky?) But I'd be very interested too. Thanks for the opinion.


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I'm an ex-desert racer, and have learned that handling and suspension win races, not power. I don't race anymore, but at the end of the day that improved handling and suspension are still the most important to me.
Very cool. That avatar pic is of me racing in the 2010 King of the Hammers in Johnson Valley, California. What a rush! Hard on the back and harder on the wallet though! :) And you're dead-on about suspension and handling - I've been fascinated by suspension for years - in case you're interested here's a little article I wrote some years back:

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#14
11-04-2012, 04:12 PM
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Nah, I can see him comparing an ATV to a dirt bike, because I've done the same thing. I thought that the DS 650 was the ATV equivalent of the CR 500 dirt bikes I raced years ago. They were a little crude and unrefined, but were big and fast, brutally strong, and unbreakable. They had long travel suspension and sucked up the chop and hack of untracked desert better than the small 450cc sport ATVs did.
Great analogy (You raced CR500? - you're a nut! :) <- I mean that in a good way. I think perhaps what the less intellectually capable person is unable to fathom is that we are using examples and analogies to explain and discuss concepts. No reasonably intelligent person would believe we are saying "riding an ATV is just exactly like riding a dirt bike" or that we would ever expect it to be so.

Thanks again for the input.
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#15
11-04-2012, 04:27 PM
I've driven the Hammer trails several times in my Jeeps, but never raced them. I don't think my Jeeps would have lasted too long at race speed.

I looked at that article you wrote. It took a long time and a lot of research to write that. Thanks for the link. I've bookmarked it and plan to read it when I have some more time.
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