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@cornfedinohio why not try a Brute Force 750? Good reliability compared to the Can Am and V twin power? I'm not a fan of the brute myself, but they're the only Japanese bike that has a prayer in keeping up with the big bore machines. The BF will need better shocks and upgraded tires, but it has snap.
 

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I was never nice to the Grizzlys either. I ride with sport quads and dirt bikes. This video has me jumping 4-5’ deep cuts in the trail for drainage. This was the 2016 708cc Grizzly chasing a pair of 450 sport quads.




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That's my kind of trail!
But why were you going so slow? ;)
 

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I've been really wanting a new 4x4 quad myself. I got two new ones in the past 3 years and now have nothing but a couple older King quads we use on the farm, 700 and a 750, the 750 is my grandparents and they usually have it at their place, and the 700 is getting to be a bit rough especially as my nephew wreck it pretty good over the summer. Now I really got a hitch for something new but really I'm struggling with a decision. I had a 2016 Grizzly I bought new I thought it was very comfortable machine, to me it had awesome suspension, very plush. But even after a tuner and a clutch mods I was still unhappy with the power, and with hardly any time on it I had to do a new top-end on it for some reason which was luckily covered under warranty. I didn't like the way it turned, it acted like you got two or three hundred pounds on the the back rack and it wanted to push the front end a bit. Those two things eventually aggravated me to point of trading it off. About six months or so before trading in the grizzly I bought a 2017 renegade xxc 1000. That was a blast to ride, the power is extremely fun. I was pretty unhappy with the stiffness of the suspension, I tried several different adjustments and could never get it to ride anywhere near as plush as the grizzly or the other machines I've been on. To me it was a very rough riding quad over rocks and logs and such.
Other than that I really enjoyed it except all the problems that seem to come up with it. I had electrical problems with it, I had axle boot staring right around the clamps, I had rear end leaks I had a bolt holding drive shaft on that kept coming loose even with Loctite. It seems like I had one or two other problems with it but I can't remember what they were. The last straw was when I got it back from the last repair. It immediately, the minute I pulled off the trailer developed a pretty bad knocking sound in the transmission. But I had driven 4 hours away to do a weekend trip I had decided I was just going to run it until it broke. It never did break and never did seem to get worse but it was a pretty bad knocking sound. I never did figure out what it was but figured it was going to cost a pretty penny to get it fixed, and that with all the other issues I'd already had I decided to trade it off with the grizzly and get a 4-seat RZR. I love the power of the Can-Am but they are a pain to work on an proved to me to be pretty unreliable at least as far as the four-wheelers go. May be unreliable isn't the word but definitely very very high maintenance. I considered a Polaris Sportsman but they're pretty notorious for not holding up well either. And I have had two different Polaris machines now both have given me quite a few issues. So I don't feel comfortable getting a Polaris either especially considering the cost. Both Polaris and Can-Am are extremely expensive and they cost a guy big money in repairs and maintenance, it is very difficult to want either one of them.
My decisions now are another king quad 750, Kodiak 700 or a Brute Force 750. I've got pros and cons with all three and none of them really stand out as being the one to get. If Yamaha would build a machine like they've got but with 10 to 15 more horsepower my decision time would be over. My biggest gripe with Yamaha is a lack of power.
I seem to be leaning more towards the Kodiak only because I know the potential the 686 has for more power and therefore with a little bit of work I could probably gain 10 to 15 more horsepower and still be more reliable then a Can-Am or Polaris.
 

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The new 686cc motor won't have the top end issue like you had with your 2016 which had the 708cc. And the handling issues can be resolved on a new Grizz by having your dealer put on better tires before you take it home; the cheep tires are the biggest complaint of new Grizz & Kodiak owners. You can do mods to the Grizz to get more power to the ground as you know but your not going to get the feel of a 750 twin or a 1000. What you will get with the Yamaha is reliability, comfort and piece of mind.
 

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Yamaha reliability is pretty important no doubt about it.
On my 16 grizzly I tried 3 different sets of tires, all having the same issues. I took it to the dealer with the complaint to have them check the toe-in and toe out and some other things that might be wrong, and they found nothing just seems to be the nature of the new grizzly or at least the 16 model that I had. Thid Issue I noticed the minute I pulled it out of the truck. That's why my three choices include the Kodiak and not the grizzly because I think maybe tje Kodiak won't have the same issue,
as it's narrower than a grizzly.
 

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Discussion Starter #26
I’ll start researching the Brute again. Last time I looked at it I recall the entire front end being plastic. It reminds me of a mid 80s Cameron. If you hit something it’s all plastic junk out front. The other item I recall was it has a very high seat height. The brakes being inside the rear diff also worry me. As the brakes wear all the debris will cover the bearings inside the diff. I asked a couple guys about how long the rear brakes last. I was told 1200 miles. That would mean taking the rear diff out about 5 times a year for me. Seems like I’d spend the same money I spent on the XXC1000 rear diffs. I’m gonna go read up On the Brute again.
Thanks for a great conversation. I’ve always respected this forum.



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I put Maxxis Zillas on my Kodiak one inch wider and taller all the way around and one inch spacers behind each wheel. World of difference from stock tires and handling. The rear break on the Kodiak is Bullet proof and lasts forever just change the rear diff oil once a year.
 

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I don't understand the wet brake system on the Brute Force being a problem. I've never heard that with any wet braking system. I would prefer that system as you shouldn't have to do anything to the rear brake for a very long time if ever.
I think the brute forces are good machines, I seen them put through a lot of abuse and keep going. My biggest complaint with a Brute Force is the look of the front end and the low ground clearance. The Brute Force as less ground clearance than anything else, I think maybe even some Honda models have more clearance than the Brute, that's pretty sad. But the brute No Doubt has the power.

the king quads a really good machines as well and have pretty good power, for single-cylinder they have really good low in torque, definitely more then the Yamaha 686. I've always been a fan of the king quad.
the major dislike I have with the king quad is the clutch exhaust comes out pretty low by the back rack, and even though I avoid deep water and mud holes every once in awhile I get surprised by how deep a particular spot is and it never fails that water enters into the clutch system through that exhaust port. The only other real complaint is the suspension is pretty hard and not nearly as plush as my 16 grizzly that I used to have.
the 686 in the grizzly or the Kodiak definitely down on power compared to the brute force and even the king quad 750. But that doesn't bother me too much because I used to own a Raptor 700 and did lots of engine mods to that motor and made it very fast, it was a lot of fun dynoed right at 70 horsepower to the wheels and 50 foot pounds of torque. It was a blast to ride and that was all done with a stock crank no turbo and no-nos. So I know the potential at the grizzly and Kodiak have for just a tad more power.
Can anyone tell me what the suspension is like on the new Kodiak compared to the new grizzly? I know the grizzly is very plush, it was a very comfortable machine to ride. Is the Kodiak the same in that regard?
the other question I have with the Kodiak is does it turn better than the grizzly? Like I posted above my 16 Grizzly did not turn well, the front end wanted to push a bit, it acted like there was two to three hundred pounds on the back rack. That's about the biggest reason keeping me from getting another grizzly, that and I prefer the narrower machine like the Kodiak. I just don't want to get the Kodiak and find out it's got a bit of front-end push just like the grizzly.
 

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Discussion Starter #32
I put Maxxis Zillas on my Kodiak one inch wider and taller all the way around and one inch spacers behind each wheel. World of difference from stock tires and handling. The rear break on the Kodiak is Bullet proof and lasts forever just change the rear diff oil once a year.
I’m curious as to “it lasts a long time”. Once a year rear diff changes wouldn’t work for my riding. I rode 6200 miles last year. Changing brakes on a Grizzly or my XXC1000 is a 30 minute job.
Opening the rear diff seems like an enormous pain if I need to do it multiple times a year. Also, I see the Brute has a Ujoint in The rear drive shaft. Greasing that looks like a real hat trick. I had to replace my Can Ams rear drive shaft and Rear diff 3 times last year. I changed the rear diff fluid every 500 miles.
I also see the Brute has cables to lock the front diff and work the rear brakes. Cables are an issue with mud and water. Cable actuated items is 70’s technology.


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That's a good point about the cables, I never thought about that much.
Is the grizzly the only one that's all hydraulic?

I know the king quad hydraulic on the front but it might be cables that work the rear wet brake system. As I'm sitting here thinking about it it's quite possible that any and all wet brake systems are done with cables.
 

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That's a good point about the cables, I never thought about that much.
Is the grizzly the only one that's all hydraulic?

I know the king quad hydraulic on the front but it might be cables that work the rear wet brake system. As I'm sitting here thinking about it it's quite possible that any and all wet brake systems are done with cables.
Yamaha reliability is pretty important no doubt about it.
On my 16 grizzly I tried 3 different sets of tires, all having the same issues. I took it to the dealer with the complaint to have them check the toe-in and toe out and some other things that might be wrong, and they found nothing just seems to be the nature of the new grizzly or at least the 16 model that I had. Thid Issue I noticed the minute I pulled it out of the truck. That's why my three choices include the Kodiak and not the grizzly because I think maybe tje Kodiak won't have the same issue,
as it's narrower than a grizzly.
cbull. I have watch your analysis on YouTube..and read yours comments ...thanks ... you are the main reason why I so far didn’t’t change my 09 grizzly for 2019 or 2020 grizzly. The pushing problem bothers me as well.. Last year I was riding and talked to a guy that just bought a 2017 se grizz. He was riding with is wife on the back . He told me that he like the bike but felt like there was no weight on the front !!!! So it is tippy on the back .. sometime we are 2 on the grizz and that part scares me...a lot. ..also I plow my land and my 09 is so manoeuvrable...so is the turn radius on the new one is less than the old one.?maybe it is related with the gas thank being more at the back with 2016 and up..maybe is was the weight of the motor from 2016 to 2018 and maybe it is less a problem with the 686 cc on 2019 and up.. I don,t know but I am planning a real test with my dealer... I am leaning toward upgrading mine to a 2014-2015 model which adress most of my 09 problems..which is body roll on the front and better power steering..
 

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Glad my video was useful. Not at all a YouTube expert but feel I should try to get info out there. Stuff that I wished I found before hand.
I don't know for sure but I feel there is 2 things, 1 or both that contribute to the turning issue, very light front-end or the extra 2inch width.
If all a person does is drive down a nice road or casually drives around out in the pasture, they will probably never notice it. But is was a constant irritation to me, even a couple friends and my wife complained about it. My wife pretty much just road rides, or did. Now she's just a passenger in the rzr.
That's one reason why I've been looking at the Kodiak, thinking maybe it turns better, more like the older grizzlies or king quads.
Dealer close to me right now don't do test rides, really hoping to find some one with a newer Kodiak that will let me try it out a bit.
Although it's starting to sound like the Kodiak has different suspension then the grizzly and rides much stiffer. If that's true, that will be a big disappointment. Just dont see anything out right now that is worth the money to me.
With the buying and selling /trading I've lost probably close to $12000 on my last 2 atv's in the past 3 years. Can't afford to keep doing that. Lol
 

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Glad my video was useful. Not at all a YouTube expert but feel I should try to get info out there. Stuff that I wished I found before hand.
I don't know for sure but I feel there is 2 things, 1 or both that contribute to the turning issue, very light front-end or the extra 2inch width.
If all a person does is drive down a nice road or casually drives around out in the pasture, they will probably never notice it. But is was a constant irritation to me, even a couple friends and my wife complained about it. My wife pretty much just road rides, or did. Now she's just a passenger in the rzr.
That's one reason why I've been looking at the Kodiak, thinking maybe it turns better, more like the older grizzlies or king quads.
Dealer close to me right now don't do test rides, really hoping to find some one with a newer Kodiak that will let me try it out a bit.
Although it's starting to sound like the Kodiak has different suspension then the grizzly and rides much stiffer. If that's true, that will be a big disappointment. Just dont see anything out right now that is worth the money to me.
With the buying and selling /trading I've lost probably close to $12000 on my last 2 atv's in the past 3 years. Can't afford to keep doing that. Lol
I also have a 2016 wolverine SE. i tought that you can buy a yamaha product without worries but that is not the case..it is a good machine but the confidence is not at 100%. I will let you my opinion when i will go to the dealer.
 

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Discussion Starter #37
Cbull
Can you post a link to your YouTube channel? I’d like to see your stuff.
Thanks for the topics and conversation.

I’d love to hear from a 2020 owner with miles 9m a Grizzly.


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... I bought a 2017 renegade xxc 1000. That was a blast to ride, the power is extremely fun. I was pretty unhappy with the stiffness of the suspension, I tried several different adjustments and could never get it to ride anywhere near as plush as the grizzly or the other machines I've been on. To me it was a very rough riding quad over rocks and logs and such...
I rode my brother's 2018 Can Am 650XT last year riding on trails that I have put a lot of miles on with my Grizzly. I noticed how rough the Can Am rode compared to my Grizzly and had to ride through the rough trails much shower than normal. I even have the preload cranked up to the highest setting on the front and 2nd highest setting in the rear.

I attributed a lot of the rough ride on the Can Am to the difference in size of the wheels. The Can Am has 26" tires on 14" wheels vs. the 26.5" tires on my 12" wheels. I feel that the extra 2.5" of sidewall on my tires help give the Grizzly a noticeably smoother ride.

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Discussion Starter #39
I stiff suspension is better for high speed and jumps. Going slower worsens the ride. Can Ams are go fast bikes. They aren’t for everyone. If I buy a 2020 Grizzly it will need a serious suspension upgrade to stiffen the suspension.



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Cbull
Can you post a link to your YouTube channel? I’d like to see your stuff.
Thanks for the topics and conversation.

I’d love to hear from a 2020 owner with miles 9m a Grizzly.


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For some reason I can't find it in my YouTube Library. I seem to have some videos missing in there. I'll do a search and see if I can't locate it. Basically a video where I was talking about my new renegade 1000 my grizzly and my older King Quad.
 
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